from William Spiegel's grand jury testimony on February 3,
here to read William Spiegel's testimony in its entirety.)
SPIEGEL, called as a witness, having first been duly sworn
by the Foreman, testified:
Would you briefly tell the grand jury when you first met Zimmerman...
Well, we met David Zimmerman [a.k.a. David
Carpenter], I would say in the very early years of
our marriage. We were living in Baltimore, and I don't
remember specifically how I met him. We were living downtown
at the time and we simply came to know him and saw him periodically
thereafter in a rather friendly sort of way. He was a rather
- we found him an interesting person, a pleasant person
to know, and we continued seeing him at intervals throughout
Now with reference to your apartment at 112 East Madison Street,
you lived there at one time, didn't you?
That is right.
Can you recall when you moved there?
We moved there in the fall of 1937.
The fall of 1937. Now, how long did you live there?
I believe through the - possibly to the fall of the following
Now, prior to your living on Madison Street, did Carpenter
or Zimmerman at any time ask you to make use of your apartment?
Prior to when?
Prior to when you moved into the Madison Street address.
That is, prior to October of 1937.
Now, will you try and fix the approximate time after you moved
into the Madison Street apartment, as to when Zimmerman approached
you for the purpose of using your apartment?
We - I mean, myself and my wife - have tried to do that, and
we weren't able to definitely, but we believe it was
in the fall of that year, or some time soon after we moved
there, but we can't seem to recollect any exact interval
Now, going back to the Madison Street address, will you give
in your own words as completely as possible, what conversations
you, or you heard your wife, had with Zimmerman concerning
the use of your apartment?
My recollection of that is extremely hazy. As a matter of
fact, I can't recall the exact time that we actually
had that conversation, nor the circumstances that surrounded
it, but I do simply recall that the conclusion of the conversation
was that he would be able to use our apartment, and that we
arranged for a rental - or that he would contribute towards
our rent, the amount of twenty dollars. Beyond that, I have
no specific recollections.
I would like to show you a photograph and this is a
photograph of Whittaker Chambers .... and ask you if you have
come in contact with Whittaker Chambers....
Well, ... it is very difficult for me to say now that I recognize
his face as a result of having seen him in my apartment, or
simply that I have seen him in the newspapers and also having
seen him last week.
The grand jury would like to know as to whether this Whittaker
Chambers is the individual who was brought to your apartment
or introduced to you by Carpenter or Zimmerman.
I understand that. I would say that this bears a resemblance
to that individual.
And how would you describe that individual that Zimmerman
brought to you?
I would describe him as a man that is short, sort of chubby,
round head, large eyes, I think his teeth were not very good
at the time.
Did you at any time have any knowledge that he was using your
apartment for the purpose of photography and for developing
No, I did not.
Did you have any knowledge that he used either the bathroom
or the kitchen in your apartment for photography purposes?
Did you ever observe this fellow Chambers in your apartment?
Not without Zimmerman.
Now didn't it occur to you and your wife to wonder as
to why he wanted to pay you twenty dollars a month? If you
knew the purpose, then you could judge as to whether you wanted
your apartment used or not.
Well, simply that our feeling toward Zimmerman was not such
as to have led us at that time to question his purpose, other
than we knew he did a great deal of writing, and we somehow
or other didn't think - it didn't occur to us -
that he would use our apartment for some purpose that we would
ourselves object to. We had a fair amount of confidence in
the man at that time.
Chambers says that he was brought to your apartment by Zimmerman
and he met you there, and he used your apartment for photography
purposes. You people weren't there, you see. In other
words he says he used it in the evening sometimes while you
would go out to the movies or, if you came home early, you
would go someplace else. But he used it for photography purposes
and for developing film. Well, it's a well-known fact,
without you having any technical knowledge, that you can't
just start to develop film and pack it away and take it away
with you. You have got to leave it out to dry, you see. And
with reference to developing film, you have got to make a
little bit of a mess either in the kitchen or in a bathroom,
to do it. And so, consequently, didn't you notice any
indications around the apartment? Not that you observed him
doing it, not that you saw him doing it; but didn't you
observe any indications around the apartment that it might
have been used for some purpose?
Well, there were none. There was no indication whatsoever
that I can recall. And I might go a step further: that I myself
have had an amateur's interest in photography for a long
time and I think I would have recognized such a thing if I
to read excerpts from Anna Spiegel's testimony.